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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:35 pm 

Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:59 pm
Posts: 247
Sure heli hero is strong, but if u lose when u have an aa hero and aa, you must've done something wrong.
as for elo, everybody else has to face the same problems, just because you have to win 3 games for every loss doesnt mean all the other players can win once for every 10 losses. If you're playing top players in tourneys, they are at the same risk as you and if you win you would gain just about as much as you would lose.


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:32 pm 

Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 2:18 pm
Posts: 728
It's like Inferno says ... once one gets a high rating it gets very hard to improve it. Sooner or later one hits a patch of bad games ... like me yesterday, where in just 4 games I lost over 50 sealed rating points. It's particularly hard in sealed because there are inevitably games where your cards suck too much and the other guy's are strong.

The thing that might be a problem, is the weight put on FFA and random team games (especially FFA) ... it's too hard to get those games, so too hard to close a gap there.


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:01 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:26 am
Posts: 103
I wont even took heli hero in sealed unless i have at least minor heal, that hero damn expensive and can be useless depending on the enemy's units it faced


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:33 pm 

Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 2:18 pm
Posts: 728
Heli hero seems balanced to me. There are times when it decides games, and there are times where it kinda sucks.


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:42 pm 

Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:59 pm
Posts: 247
well if u say it like that, any card can potentially decide a game/suck
and when you say you want to improve your rating when its very high, ill just tell you this, ratings are meant to show which player is better or worse than others, the number used for the rating is just a way of getting to that. if you want, you could get points for both winning and losing and its just a race to see who gets more rating points. I'm sure thats what you want right? no way to lose rating at all, no reason to complain


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:45 pm 

Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 2:18 pm
Posts: 728
Victim wrote:
well if u say it like that, any card can potentially decide a game/suck
and when you say you want to improve your rating when its very high, ill just tell you this, ratings are meant to show which player is better or worse than others, the number used for the rating is just a way of getting to that. if you want, you could get points for both winning and losing and its just a race to see who gets more rating points. I'm sure thats what you want right? no way to lose rating at all, no reason to complain


No, the problem is that in some of the modalities, like FFA and random teams, it's possible to open huge gaps that are hard to close because of the lack of games. So you try to compensate where there are games, but there it becomes very hard. It's just that.

And I'm not complaining either, just talking about it.

Hmpf is talking about it as well, and I dont see the negativity towards him, either.


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:47 pm 
Battle Dex Team

Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2009 4:02 pm
Posts: 1222
What you say is correct Geral. The real issue is we need more people so we can have more of the other game types.


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:58 pm 
Battle Dex Testing Team
Battle Dex Testing Team
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Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2010 7:06 pm
Posts: 348
Location: Munich
Ok so my initial post sounded more like a whine than being constructive criticism - I should not write those right after a loss.
Of course I have also won some sealed matches where I faced heli hero, but usually because it was used badly (like on open terrain and without additional debuffs).
But after having read all your comments, I still think the unit isn't well balanced. Neither of you had an argument based on a fact as do I.
Just take a look at the cost list I made.
And don't tell ma a fighter is a good counter unit. It needs up to 5 turns to kill the heli and is 3/4 the cost.
I'd say make the unit 225g and I'm satisfied.

And about the Elo system:
It could be abused easily - just imagine a high ranked player creating a new account and getting in queue for sealed matches or tournament (if his target is there too). This way he can cause a giant rating loss for another good player. If one plays tourneys this way all the time one could harm others a lot more than winning with his high ranked account, all while risking nothing.
This might sound irrelevant now but when we get tournament entries or whatever (i read something about that) I hope we don't see such things.


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:50 am
Posts: 227
Location: Barcelona
One solution i posed last week to make FFA games more accesible is to offer a 3 player rated FFA. This would really liven up the game and help keep certain members playing. I really hope this will be considered.

_________________
+HighVibes


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 Post subject: Re: Heli Hero imba, ELO rating system sucks ass
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:42 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:26 am
Posts: 103
hmpf wrote:
Ok so my initial post sounded more like a whine than being constructive criticism - I should not write those right after a loss.
Of course I have also won some sealed matches where I faced heli hero, but usually because it was used badly (like on open terrain and without additional debuffs).
But after having read all your comments, I still think the unit isn't well balanced. Neither of you had an argument based on a fact as do I.
Just take a look at the cost list I made.
And don't tell ma a fighter is a good counter unit. It needs up to 5 turns to kill the heli and is 3/4 the cost.
I'd say make the unit 225g and I'm satisfied.

And about the Elo system:
It could be abused easily - just imagine a high ranked player creating a new account and getting in queue for sealed matches or tournament (if his target is there too). This way he can cause a giant rating loss for another good player. If one plays tourneys this way all the time one could harm others a lot more than winning with his high ranked account, all while risking nothing.
This might sound irrelevant now but when we get tournament entries or whatever (i read something about that) I hope we don't see such things.


Based on the same logic, don't tell me a fighter is a good counter unit for regular heli. It needs up to 3 turns to kill the heli and is 10/11 the cost.
Also based on the same logic, don't tell me a heli is a good counter unit for Heavy hero. It needs up to 5 turns to kill the heavy and is 3/5 the cost.

Btw, fighter needs 4 turns to kill heli hero not 5

The abuse actually already happen, its called smurf


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